Chinatown Punk Wars

The Chinatown Punk Wars
The fierce competition between Madame Wong's and the Hong Kong Cafe became known as the Chinatown Punk Wars.

Madame Wong became exceedingly jealous of the success of the Hong Kong (even though they chose to cater to different musical niches). When the police raided the Hong Kong Cafe looking for under-age drinking, all fingers pointed back to Madame Wong's as the rat.

Though Madame Wong had a hard as nails reputation, she was also beloved by many of the bands as a favorite patron. She allowed each group that played their to simply split the entire admission fee. So, in deed, bands got paid by their popularity.

However, Madame Wong made it clear that she would not book any band that played down the street at the Hong Kong.

She would say, If a band plays the Hong Kong one night then comes to me the next, no - I wouldn't book them because that would be bad business.

However, Barry Seidel (booker for the Hong Kong Cafe) strongly felt strongly that a good band would draw an audience regardless of where they played the night before.

Ultimately, Madame Wong banned most of the punk bands that played at the Hong Kong Café, and focused on Blondie and Cars-influenced power pop and new wave like Sensible Shoes, the Naughty Sweeties, 20/20, the Motels and the Knack.

L.A. Times June 24, 1979

Today, the former Hong Kong cafe is a gift store

2008 photo: tlc

After a trashing incident, Madame Wong decided not to book anymore punk bands at all. She said they gave her nothing but trouble. She said she favored the more skinny tie 'progressive pop' new wave type music anyways.

Today, the former Madame Wong's use as a private residence.

2008 photo: tlc

2008 photo: tlc

2008 photo: tlc

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Hong Kong Cafe

The Hong Kong Cafe 

425 Gin Ling Way

Looking at the former Hong Kong Cafe

2008 photo: tlc

The Hong Kong Cafe existed from about June 1979 to early 1981. 

It officially opened its stage to punk/rock music on June 5th, 1979.

L.A. Times  - June 11, 1979

High Energy at Hong Kong Cafe

by Richard Cromelin

Excerpt from article

The Hong Kong Cafe, just a few pogo-hops away from the prosperous Madame Wong's in Chinatown, entered the local-bands fray last week, and its first weekend show yielded both positive and negative results. 

The Hong Kong welcomes some of the bands rejected by Wong's as too rowdy - among them the Alley Cats and the the Bags, who played Friday. Nor is there an age limit.  Accordingly, the energy and mayhem levels were high on Friday, and were further compressed and  intensified by the room's small size.

 

Brawling, careening participants jammed the floor in front of the stage, and if you chose not to enter the fray, you could catch only a glimpse of the band through an occasional gap between flying bodies. Sound was adequate, but seemed somewhat muffled by the crowd. 

The Hong Kong Cafe fiercely competed with Madame Wong's for booking the best bands and attracting the largest crowds.

Former Madame Wong's (green building) looking towards the former Hong Kong Cafe (red building)

2008 photo: tlc

Looking across courtyard from the former Madame Wong's
to the former Hong Kong Cafe 

The Go-G0's frequently played at the Hong Kong Cafe
(Madame Wong would not book girl singers or bands)

Los Angeles Times - July 24, 1979

Plugz, GoGos at Hong Kong Cafe

by Kristine McKenna

Excerpt from article

It was muggy and packed in the Hong Kong Cafe Friday night. Plainclothes cops were on the prowl for underage drinkers, all of which aided in charging up the already high-spirited crowd that turned out to see local champs the Plugz. The group has become as dependable as taxes, always delivering an impeccably professional, heartfelt dose of rock.

The Plugz turned in a gripping set, but we've come to expect that. The real news of the evening was opening act the GoGos. When the GoGos debuted six months ago all it had going for it was its all-girl novelty status and lots of enthusiasm. It's since grown up into a fine rock band. Friday's show introduced a better repertoire of material, a new drummer (Gina Schock -a feisty addition), and revealed the group to be steadily gaining control of its instruments. Guitar leads are still a bit ragged but no matter - it it's managed to come this far in six months its future looks more than good. 

The GoGos short-term master of the basic Chuck Berry cum punk shtick is impressive; however, its ace in the hole is its attitude, refreshingly free of the chip-on-the-shoulder butch stance commonly assumed by women rockers. The GoGos don't trade on their girlish charms, but neither do they deny  them. They're young and cute and enjoy being cute. 

The focal point of the five-girl crew is lead singer Belinda Carlisle, an energetic beauty with bee-stung lips and a Monroe-esque vulnerability. Carlisle's voice is adequate, but her charm as a performer lies in revealing that she cares. 

The Hong Kong Cafe closed it doors to music in January of 1981.

Los Angeles Times - January 18, 1981

L.A. Beat: The Hong Kong's Swan Song

By Terry Atkinson

Excerpt from article

The Hong Kong Cafe, a key center of anction in L.A.'s rock renaissance since early 1979, closed its doors for good after its New Year's Eave show - a victim of the rapidly changing scene it helped to promote. 

Situated in the upstairs rooms of a Chinatown restaurant across a courtyard from 

rival Madame Wongs, the exotically decorated club was the focal point of the new-wave movement's/ experimental hard core during its thriving first year of operation. 

When the larger, more established Starwood and Whisky clubs in West Hollywood  began to lure away the top drawing act of this school, however, the lineups at the Hong Kong weren't as potent. A typical night at the club in late 1980 would find three unknown bands of unpredictable styles and quality playing. 

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Madame Wong's

Madame Wong's Restaurant
Madame Wong's restaurant was located at 949 Sun Mun Way in Chinatown, Los Angeles.

Madame Wong opened Madame Wong's Chinese cuisine in 1970 with her husband George Wong. It was located in the original 1938 Rice Bowl restaurant.

Madame Wong's featured Polynesian music, cocktails and dancing. However, by 1978, the restaurant (as was Chinatown) was suffering from economic hard times and it had very few night time customers.

L.A. Times ad for Madame Wong's - February 10, 1974

In October of 1978, entrepreneur/music promoter Paul Greenstein persuaded Ester Wong to host rock/punk music in her restaurant in the evening - (this idea was similar to what the Philippine restaurant Mabuhay Gardens was doing successfully in San Francisco).

L.A. Times article dated October 1, 1978

Ester Wong was a no-nonsense business woman. She was born and educated in Shanghai and had traveled the world with her businessman father in her early life she.

Ester Wong - Music Promoter

Ester Wong (1917–2005) reinvented herself into the 'godmother of punk'

Inadvertently, Madame Wong became the godmother of punk music. She became the local music scene's biggest supporter. Her stage often hosted bands such as: Oingo Boingo, the Police, X, the Motels, 20/20, the Knack, the Textones, the Go-Go's, the Plimsouls, the Plane English and many, many more.

Los Angeles Times - October 5, 1978

Two Rock Bands at Madame Wong's 

by Richard Cromelin

excerpt from article

The Polynesian Maidens, the regular attraction at Madame Wong's restaurant in Chinatown, gave way Tuesday to rock 'n' roll, and it the capacity attendance in the colorful, comfortable room is any indication, the site could prove to be a valuable platform for venue starved local bands. The only element missing for good rock 'n' roll energy is an open space for standing and dancing. 

However, Madame Wong had strict rules for those who wanted to play at her club. She limited the clientele to those over 21, and all but banned girl singers, calling them 'no good, always trouble'. She would often tour the venue during performances sniffing around for marijuana smoke. She had a reputation as a dragon lady. In fact, she once stopped a show until two members of the Ramones cleaned up what they had written on the bathroom walls.

The sign above the door

Due to the success of the Chinatown location, Madame Wong opened Madame Wong's West was opened in Santa Monica. It operated from 1978 to 1991. The Chinatown location of Madame Wong's closed in 1985.

L.A. Times ad c. 1979

How the door to former Madame Wong's looks today

2008 photo: tlc

949 Sun Mun Way

2008 photo: tlc

Looking at the former site of Madame Wong's

2008 photo: tlc

Former site of Madame Wong's

2008 photo: tlc

Madame Wong's in Chinatown closed in 1985.

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1979 When Chinatown Was Punk - pt 1

Looking south down Broadway
from Chinatown towards downtown L.A.



East Gate to New Chinatown
951 N. Broadway, L.A.
(The Gate of Maternal Virtues)

2008 photo: tlc

The 5 tiered Golden Pagoda

2008 photo: tlc

1979 L.A. - Unbelievably, the best place to hear live, local punk music was in - Chinatown.

In the '70's - some of Chinatown's oldest restaurants become new punk music venues. Such as...

• • The Rice Bowl restaurant becomes Madame Wong's
  • Joy Yuen Low restaurant would become the Hong Kong Cafe

  
  

Historical notes on the New Chinatown
The new Chinatown in downtown L.A. was built in 1938 - after the old Chinatown was torn down to make way for the new Union Station.

L.A.'s Union Station (train station)

When it opened in 1938, the new Chinatown consisted of many notable Chinese restaurants, shops, an herbal store, a grocery store, a bean cake factory, a Chinese deli, bakery and offices - that were all moved from Los Angeles' Old Chinatown, not quite a mile away.

Location of L.A.'s New Chinatown

The Enchanting charms of Old China in Los Angeles
For over three decades New Chinatown was a successful tourist draw - with plenty of top notch restaurants and souvenir shops. In fact, the Central Plaza was one of the first pedestrian malls in America.

The Rice Bowl restaurant

One of the original restaurants was called the Rice Bowl. The Rice Bowl - located on the upper floor - it was the Palace in the Sky. In the day- it was home to the only Asian cabaret in town and featured live music and dancing. Later, in the 1970's, this establishment would become Madame Wong’s restaurant.

Early photo of the Rice Bowl restaurant in Chinatown, which later later would become Madame Wong's

LMU/LA digital collections

Front door to the Rice Bowl which later became Madame Wong's

1938

L.A. Times Ad c. 1945

Joy Yuen Low restaurant

Nearby the Rice Bowl was the Joy Yuen Low restaurant, located at 425 Gin Ling Way. It would later become the Hong Kong Cafe.

Early photo of the Joy Yuen Low restaurant


Early photo of Central Plaza with Joy Yuen Low restaurant
and Chinaware and Gin Ling Way Gifts

LMU/LA digital collections

Site today
Left to right: former sites of: the Forbidden Palace restaurant,
GinLing Gifts, Chinaware and
the Hong Kong Cafe (red building)

2008 photo: tlc

Some early post cards of Chinatown from the 1960's.

Looking west down Gin Ling Way toward the West Gate
Corner of Central Plaza showing Tuey Far Low restaurant on the left, Chinaware, Gin Ling Gifts and Forbidden Palace restaurant on the right

LMU/LA digital collections

Same view as above - post card format

LMU/LA digital collections

Same view as above - Early view of the Central Plaza - looking NW
Tuey Far Low Chop Suey restaurant on left

LMU/LA digital collections

Former Tuey Far Low Chop Suey restaurant
as it appears today (Golden Dragon gift)

2008 photo: tlc

Kim Ling Inn - 1938


As it appears today, former Kim Ling Inn is now the
Hop Sing Tong Benevolent Society




Former Far Tuey Low chop suey restaurant is now
Golden Dragon Gifts

However, by the 1970's, Chinatown was suffering economically with the influx of new immigrants to the area and out flux of tourist dollars and the more established businesses.

Some Historical markers:
1975

The end of war in Southeast Asia results in many ethnic Chinese immigrants and refugees, some of whom eventually relocate to L.A.'s Chinatown.

1977

Throughout the late 1970's there is continued rapid growth in New Chinatown due primarily to an increase in Southeast Asian Chinese. This leads to commercial activity being supported by both ethnic trade and tourism rather than just tourism as during the 1950's and 60

1979

A large influx of Chinese Vietnamese boat people into New Chinatown occurs.

1980

The Los Angeles Community Redevelopment Agency designates Chinatown as a redevelopment area. source: Chinese Americans in Los Angeles

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1977/78 -GoGo Connections

Connecting the Dots . . . . . . . . . . . . .

So let's see...Belinda knew Lorna who knew Darby (the Germs) who knew Pleasant who knew Darby who knew Hellin&Trudie -plungers (@Capitol Records swap -meet 4/77) who knew Excene of X (@Capitol Records swap-meet) who lived with Margo and Kittra Allen (girlfriend of Billy Zoom of X ) (Kittra was the 1st GoGo manager) who knew Hellin&Trudie who knew Pleasant who knew Darby who knew Alice who knew the Germs who knew the Dickies who knew Charlotte (Leonard Phillips) who knew DJ Bonebrake (drummer for the Eyes) who knew the Germs who knew Pleasant who met Jane.

Jane, Margo and Belinda

In 1977 - The GoGo's were not a band yet. They are not even an idea of a band yet. For the most part, they had never even played any instrument that required plugging in. But - in less than a year's time - it would all start to come together.

At this time, Belinda and Jane and Charlotte were busy being the girl friend of a guy in a band or a fan of a band that played at the Masque or played in some lame band. (There was a Dickie connection here somewhere)

BELINDA Carlisle was living in Hollywood and started to hang out more and more at the newly opened Masque club. Her high school friend and room mate, Lorna Doom, played bass guitar for friend Darby's band The Germs. It seems that by now most of Belinda's friends were in bands, working on local fanzines, or are just hanging out at the Masque.

Belinda Carlisle at the Masque

In early 1978 Belinda moved into the Canterbury apartment with friend Lorna (Terry) Doom. She was dating Dickie drummer Karlos Kabollera.

Canterbury Apartments in Hollywood

2008photo:tlc

JANE Wiedlin had met Pleasant Gehman at a vintage clothing store in Hollywood. Pleasant (ever the Germs promoter) told Jane about a show coming up at the Masque and gave her a flyer for it. So - of course, Jane had to go check it out. She soon became a Masque regular. In early 1978, Jane moved into the Canterbury apartments. She dated the Alice Bags' drummer Terry Graham.

Jane at the Masque

photo: JennyLens

MARGO Olaverria was a punk music enthusiasts. From hanging out at the Starwood and and clubs, she was a friend of Exene Cervenka and the whole X crowd. She lived at the X house in Hancock park for awhile. Through Excene, she became friends with Darby and Lorna and Hellin Killer and the Plunger girls.

Margot at the Masque

photo:Al Flipside

Margo had recently gone to London (saw the Sex Pistol) and came back all wanting to be a punk rocker too. She even started to learn how to play bass guitar. Members of X gave her guitar lessons. She had been a regular at the Starwood. Now, of course, she goes to the Masque because that is where the new scene was going on.

In early 1978 Margo moved into the Canterbury apartments in Hollywood.

The first time Margo met Belinda was backstage at the Whisky when the Dickies were playing there.

Belinda and Margo at the Masque

photo: Ann Summa

Disgraceland - Another favorite place to crash was the nearby apartment at Selma and Cassil Place nick-named Disgracelend.

Belinda and Blaster

Photo by Janette Beckman

Charlotte Caffey was a trained musician (as in college) and played bass for the local punk band The Eyes. The Eyes were a sort of a Masque band from the get-go and play there pretty frequently. Charlotte was dating a guy from the Dickies - Leonard Phillips. The Dickies played the Masque too. Belinda was also dated a Dickie at this time - their drummer, Karlos Kabollera. Belinda and her friends would spend a lot of time hanging out at the Masque and with bands such as the Dickies.

Charlotte at the Masque

photo: Michael Yampolsky

Margot met Elisa Bello through a friend from high school. Elissa played drums. Elissa came to LA from Buffalo and wanted to put an all girl rock bank together. She initially wanted something more edgy and rebellious. But not English. She had a cousin in LA who was about her age. They went to a party one night and she was introduced to Margot. She and Margot talked about starting a band.

Kittra Allen - was a former girlfriend of Billy Zoom of X. So, she knew all the X crowd. She lived at the X house on Van Ness St. in Hancock Park. Or rather, they lived with her. She became friends with who also lived there and was a friend. Later...she would go on to be the GoGo's first manager.

At this point - the girls were all just acquaintances. They knew each other just by hanging out at clubs. At this point - it was still all about having fun and acting cool. But soon that would all change.

As they hung out at the Masque and other clubs, the girls started to notice something. Many of the bands were - not that great. In fact...they were really bad. They could play better than that. Well... maybe they could do it better. After all, it was cool to be an untrained musician. It was just a thought - but, they couldn't be any worse? So, why not? hmmmm. Maybe...they should form their own band? Just a thought. hmmmm.

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